Credit Union Exam Solutions Presents With Flying Colors

Mark Treichel: Hey, everyone,
this is Mark Trakel with another

episode of With Flying Colors.

I'm excited today to be here with Jason
Sturyc, the Chief Advocacy Officer

of the Defense Credit Union Council.

Jason, how you doing today?

Jason Stverak: I'm doing great, Mark.

Yourself?

Mark Treichel: I'm doing well.

It's ex- I'm excited to have you
back on, had you back on, had you

on, I think four or five months ago.

Yeah.

It's always great to catch up with,
you know, your take on what's going

on in credit unions, your take on,
uh, uh, how DCUC is helping credit

unions in general and all that.

But in case someone hasn't listened
to that or hasn't watched it on

YouTube, could you kind of give a
little bit of your background, a

little bit of DCUC's background before
we rock and roll into some dialogue?

Jason Stverak: No, absolu- absolutely.

For me, um, after about 10 years up
on Capitol Hill, in 2001 after working

for, uh, Senator Kevin Cramer from
North Dakota, uh, handling the banking

committee for him, I was blessed
to go over and be the deputy chief

advocacy officer, uh, over at CUNA.

I worked for Ryan Donovan over there.

Uh, and then through that process,
was, uh, uh, elevated to interim chief

advocacy officer, went through the
merger, um, and then I was, uh, honored,

uh, to be asked to, uh, come over and
be the chief advocacy officer, uh,

over at DCUC as, uh, I'm the first one
that they've ever had, as, uh, they

kind of saw a growing role for DCUC-

Mark Treichel: Sure

Jason Stverak: uh, in terms of advocating
for its member credit unions but the

entire credit union industry, uh,
and ensuring that there is a chorus

full of voices, uh, that are ensuring
that the best policies interacted.

For DCUC, uh, you know,
we're in our 63rd year.

Uh, when we were created as a council
under CUNA we were primarily to represent

credit unions that were just on military
bases, but as they have grown beyond the

installation to serve the community to
serve the state, and serve the country

that serves, uh, their installation,
uh, we've grown with them, uh, because

there's- Very few issues that only
impact just defense credit unions, and

that's when you're dealing with the
Department of War, uh, or other issues.

Protecting your tax status is the
same as you're, whether you're

on a, a Air Force base or not.

Uh, ensuring, uh, good, effective
regulation is the same whether you're

on an air- uh, Army base or not.

So, uh, we've kind of grown, uh, DCUC's
voice, uh, in our activity to ensure

that, uh, our members, uh, but the entire
industry is, uh, effectively advocated,

not only up on Capitol Hill, but working
with our partners, uh, in the leagues,

uh, as well as our member institutions
at state capitals across the country.

Mark Treichel: And just, just as an
observation, I'll say that with the

merger of NAFQ and America's Credit
Unions, I, I think you kind of alluded

to this, but that kinda created a void
where there was one major the, there are

two, two, the two of the biggest trade
associations were merging, which put you

in the second slot, right, essentially.

And them, uh, bringing you on is, is
creating that opportunity for there

to be the wisdom of crowds of two
different organizations analyzing

everything and, and making their their
members' needs brought to, uh, the

powers that be to influence policy.

Jason Stverak: No, you're,
you're incredibly right.

And where they have a strength, um, in
one area, we have a strength in another.

You know, the ability to represent
those who, uh, those who serve, uh,

whether they be, uh, you know, a
veteran, active duty, you know, first

responders, et cetera you know, those,
that opens every door up on Capitol Hill.

So it's not just specific, the committees
of jurisdiction, House Financial

Services, you know, Senate Banking.

You know, we have the ability, uh,
to represent our members in House

Transportation and Infrastructure,
or Energy and Commerce uh, on a

myriad of issues as they come to
the floor, uh, or as the issues

that are impacting credit unions go
to different committees throughout

Congress and in the administration.

Mark Treichel: Great point.

And I'm gonna, I'm gonna dive into the
interchange income in one second, but-

Absolutely … you me- you mentioned
Ryan Donovan and working for him.

Yeah.

He's been on the podcast a couple times.

He's gonna be, uh, joining, uh,
the show here later in July.

Okay.

So, uh, listeners watch, l- listeners
or watchers, watch for that.

And Jason, when, when, uh, Ryan's
episode comes out- … I'll shoot

you a note so you can, uh- Please

Jason Stverak: do

… Mark Treichel: you can…

And I'm sure you, you're
still in touch with him.

Yes.

He's, uh, he's doing a lot of
good work over there at the-

Jason Stverak: Yep

… Mark Treichel: association for the FHLB.

So, all right, interchange
income and, the…

I think I saw something about
Massachusetts and some other

states where there's, uh, some
challenges facing credit unions.

Could you kind of- Yeah … dip into that?

Jason Stverak: Absolutely.

I'll start at the state level.

Um, obviously, you
referenced Massachusetts.

They are taking a look, uh, at the issue.

They've had, uh

I think they actually, they, they've
kind of been taking it the right way.

Uh, they, they brought together
a commission to study the issue.

They've asked for input from
retailers, from credit unions, from

card companies, from processors.

And next week will be
their fourth hearing.

I, I was honored to testify in the third
hearing that they were having, uh, on

the impact of modifying or changing
interchange, and its impact on defense

credit unions and our ability to serve
those members, uh, and their families.

Uh, but, uh, you know, there likely
will be some sort of, we'll call it a

solution or a process moving forward
that they'll take into the next, uh,

session of the Massachusetts legislature.

Uh, but this issue is gonna be
continually brought up across the country.

You still have in Illinois, where there
is an interchange law that is- Passed,

signed into law, but it has been, um,
uh, delayed for another year, uh, which

would, uh, not allow interchange on
tax and tips, um, as well as taxes,

uh, on, uh, uh, on your final bill.

That's in the courts right now.

You've had a federal judge has ruled
that based upon the OCC coming out

and talking about federal preemption,
that the current law will not, and I,

I kid you not, not im- does not cover
processors like, uh, or the interchange

processors like Master- Mastercard and
Visa, uh, federally chartered banks other

federally chartered savings institutions,
but will cover, uh, federally chartered

credit unions, state-chartered credit
unions, and state-chartered banks.

So, that's why we're very thankful, uh,
that the NCUA has moved very judiciously

in terms of putting out a interim rule,
uh, that, uh, that the comment period

just ended, uh, I think, uh, earlier this
week or the end of last week, um, where

they'll have that same type of exemption
for federally chartered credit unions.

Hope is that the judge will then come
back and put federally chartered credit

unions in that same where the law will not
cover them, but that still does not change

the fact that you are then putting at a
competitive disadvantage state-chartered

banks and credit unions versus their
federally chartered you know, uh, cohorts.

And the strength of the credit
union movement always has

been the dual charter system.

Absolutely.

So if we are gonna put our thumb on
the scale and say, "Hey, if you don't

wanna have this rule apply to you and
all the extra paper, uh, paperwork and

headaches, just change your charter."

And so then you'll have fewer and fewer
state charters across this country, and

that's something, uh, that we've been
raising as an issue in, in the multiple

states that this keeps getting raised.

And you saw it, it pass, it passed
the legislature in Colorado,

uh, but the governor vetoed it.

You know, you've seen it introduced
in a multitude of other states.

Uh, it was in Puerto Rico as well.

It hasn't moved more than
just beyond Illinois, but

you've seen Colorado pass it.

Maybe the next governor will sign it into-

law don't know about that when the,
uh, when the lobbying gets done.

And as soon as you have one, then
two, then four, then five, you know,

states passing this you, you've got
serious issues because if you're-

what you're essentially is creating
is multiple interchange payment

networks that you have to set up.

So if you're, let's say you're a, a
credit union in my home state, uh,

uh, uh, of North Dakota, you know,
and you have someone who is flying

through O'Hare, you know, you need
to make sure their card works there.

Mark Treichel: Right.

Jason Stverak: And which means you gotta
make sure you apply to their rules, or

you gotta go through Denver, or if you're
going through, God forbid, it passes

in Texas or something like that, you're
forcing upon credit unions the need to…

So that their members, which their
number one concern is when you talked

about debit and credit cards, is the
ability to use it wherever they go.

They don't care about the interchange
rate, they just wanna be able to use it.

And if they're not able to use it,
then you're gonna have a problem

because you're not providing
them the service that they need.

And I, I did have one CEO from the
Midwest tell me, he says, "If this

law goes into effect in the State of
Illinois, that they're just gonna send…

They're likely gonna send a note to
the members and say, 'If you're going

through Illinois, your card will not work.

We're letting you know in advance.

Take extra cash.'"

And I can understand why, because-

Mark Treichel: Yeah … you

Jason Stverak: know, it, it's a
logistical, uh, logistical nightmare.

You know, that, that's kind of where
things are at sitting at the state level.

Then you always have the, the
continual fight under Marshall

Durbin here in Washington, D.C.

It, it's kind…

It's, it's really been
quarantined would be the polite

way, uh, polite way to say it.

Uh, there, but we're always on the lookout
for where they might try to push it.

We have the NBAA and the Senate, uh, which
they'll try to move on this week or next.

Marshall and Durbin usually introduce
an amendment that would deal with

interchange on base commissaries.

They have not done that yet.

Or they'll try to do a floor amendment to
try to add the full Marshall Durbin in.

We haven't seen that amendment introduced.

Uh, or they'll try to attach it to some
must-piece must-pass piece of legislation.

We think we're in a very good position
with it, but we're not going to take

our eye off the ball, uh, and then
have it slip into a bill at 2:00 AM in

the morning in the middle of December.

Yeah.

So that's our, our worry and our
concern, and that's why we're constantly

educating members, their staff on the
negative impacts that would occur if you

pass the Marshall Durbin legislation.

Mark Treichel: Yeah, I think a-
as you're saying, a letter to

members saying your card won't work
in Il- in Il- in Illinois it…

That- that's about as bad as
advertising as Illinois could get,

other than the fact that the Chicago
Bears are moving to Indiana, right?

So-

Jason Stverak: Yeah, it- it's
that- That, that, that, that

is a negative impact, so yeah.

I mean, if you're, if you're told that,
"Hey, you can't use the form of payment

that you're used to," if you go to,
uh, even if you're just flying through

O'Hare, you can't pick up a Giordano's
or a Malinotti's or some- Right.

Yeah … garrett's Popcorn,
um, they're gonna…

it, it causes a lot of issues, and
thankfully we've seen a lot of airlines

and chambers of commerce w- seeing that as
an issue and weighing in a- against these,

uh, le- against this legislation, both at
the national level and at the state level.

Mark Treichel: That's good.

I'm glad.

It, and, and raising it in every
specter, like the a- the airlines, you-

Yeah … uh, Am- America's Credit Unions,
American Bankers Association, all the…

Th- th- this is where a trade
association shine, right?

Making people understand- Mm … the
unintended consequences of a law.

Jason Stverak: Absolutely, and that's,
you know, that's where we, we come

in with our, you know, our, our, our
expertise on the impact that would

happen for members of the Armed Forces.

You know, defense credit unions use
interchange to advance credit for those

that may not have a good credit score.

They're 18 years old.

They're going through Camp Pendleton.

You know, you want to make sure that,
hey, they've got a card, they've

got $1,000 on it, they can fix their
car, they can get groceries, they,

you know, until the next payday.

Or you're just saying, "Go to the payday
loan lender right out the front gate," of

which the military is preyed upon and has
been preyed upon, uh, by them for decades.

And for, if you take that ability
for us to take a risk on those

who choose to serve our country
it just does a disservice on our

ability to help protect them.

And y- you can take no, no greater look
than, than, you know, Vice President,

uh, Vance, uh, last year, uh, talked
about when he was at Quantico, talked

about he was so proud that he was
able to get a 25% car loan, you know.

And, and then his gunny sergeant
was like, "Well, wait a minute here.

25%, you're getting ripped off,"
and took him down to Navy Federal

and said, "Here, here's 6%."

So they're say, you know, this
18-year-old kid who doesn't have a credit

history, they, we have the resources
to be able to say, "You know what?

We believe in you.

We believe that you're a good credit
risk, even if you don't have that

three numbers, uh, those, uh, those
three numbers to tell us just yet."

Mark Treichel: Yep.

No, that's fantastic.

It's- couple other things that, that I
thought would be good to chat about today.

Uh, the NCUA board, any thought…

Have you heard anything
about what's going on there?

We've got Hauptman wanting
to get over to his new job.

Yeah.

Jason Stverak: Yeah.

Mark Treichel: We've got Cruz
coming, come, coming soon.

He's had his, he's had his hear-
his b- his hearing, I guess.

Jason Stverak: He did have his hearing.

To- And then the

Mark Treichel: other two that
are in limbo because they filed

a follow-up lawsuit, right?

Jason Stverak: Yeah.

Well, we'll take those as separate later.

Sure, yep.

Mark Treichel: Good, good.

Jason Stverak: So for John
Cruz uh, you know, I'm blessed.

I knew John.

Uh, we both worked together in the US
Senate together when we was- Oh, wow.

Cool … on, uh, uh, both,
uh, you know, uh, on committee

staff, uh, and member staff.

Uh, always found his door to always be
open, uh, willing to talk about issues.

Now he is in kind of the same wait and
see situation that everybody else is.

You have the Senate back for essentially
three weeks before they go on their

month-long break in August It is our
understanding that they're trying to

put together a package of nom- uh,
uh, nominees from every committee and

try to bring them to the floor for
some sort of, "Hey, these are gonna

pass 60 or 70 to whatever number.

Could we bring them all
together in one vote?"

That will likely not be agreed to so
they'll have to process them one by one.

Our hope is, is that, um, speak-
uh, excuse me, Majority Leader

Thune sees that we need to move the
NCUA here at the top of that list.

Uh, 'cause as you talked about Chairman
Hauptman, August 1st is one year.

He's served one year past his
term, uh, his term ending.

And the, the, I mean, the Senate should
be able to do its job to get that nominee

done and confirmed and across the board.

So our hope is, is that before they
leave for their Aug- the, uh, their

August recess on August 6th, uh,
that they've moved John Cruz to be

the next director over at the NCUA.

Uh, it gives him a great amount of time
to get over the work, put his, you know,

put his fingerprint and, and stamp on
the agency and begin moving forward.

Now, in terms for Todd and Tanya, you
had the Sup- excuse me, the Supreme

Court, uh, at the end of its current,
the last term in the Slaughter case come

out with a ruling essentially giving the
president, except for the Federal Reserve

almost unlimited power to hi- uh, to
fire you know, directors at independent

agencies, of which the NCUA is one.

It's my understanding that, uh, Todd and
Tanya are moving forward with their court

case, if I, if I understand it correctly,
uh, as they are arguing that the Slaughter

case is specific to Slaughter and the
FTC, where she was a, a commissioner.

Um, so we'll have to see how,
uh, how, how that all plays out.

I don't think, if you kind of read the
court's decision where they link in

that, that will, that argument will
be successful, but I'm not a lawyer.

I only try to play one on
TV every once in a while.

Yeah.

So but that process is still out there.

And y- and you don't know until
they rule that decision how it,

how it'll, how it'll come out.

So you could have- it's in this
district circuit court here in DC.

Whatever that decision they, that
makes, then they can appeal it up

to the Supremes, and the Supreme
Court can say, "We're gonna hear

it," or, "We're not gonna hear it."

So it may be done before the end of the
year or it may stretch into next year.

Uh, but if they can get John Cruz
on, on there, then, the board can get

back to as much as normal, uh, moving
forward as proce- uh, as possible.

Yeah.

Mark Treichel: Yeah, and as former
executive director of NCUA, as

I'm thinking about that timeline,
I'm thinking, yeah, get him

in, get him in in August 'cause
the budget's coming up, right?

You got- Yeah … that, uh, that
takes up a lot of bandwidth at NCUA.

They've gotta do a public budget
briefing or hearing, whatever,

whatever you wanna call it.

Uh, he's gotta get assimilated
to everything that's going on.

And trying to get assimilated as a
new board member and have to approve

a budget next month is not the perfect
scenario to get the optimal budget.

So hopefully- Yeah … things move
quicker than as opposed to slower.

Jason Stverak: Yeah.

We used to have a phrase
up on, up on the Hill.

It's talking about building the
airplane while you're flying it.

You, you, you don't … It's not ideal.

Mark Treichel: Yeah.

Jason Stverak: Uh, we did a
lot of that during, uh, COVID.

And uh, and so I, I think that if,
if you can get John in there give

them the month of August to get up
to speed, get the staff up to speed,

uh, I think that will be beneficial.

Mark Treichel: Yeah, no doubt.

No doubt.

Co- I, I saw something on
LinkedIn about Co- Coast Guard

funding that you had posted.

Um-

Jason Stverak: Yes.

Yes

… Mark Treichel: you wanna
talk about that a little bit?

Jason Stverak: Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, I, I think that, uh, when we
had the government shutdowns, uh, you

know, in October through November,
uh, and then the, uh, DHS shutdown,

not a lot of people know that while
the Coast Guard is considered part of

the military, they become part of the
DOD, uh, if there's a declared war.

They're currently funded through
the Department of Homeland Security.

So as DHS was not funded for long
periods of time- The Coast Guard was not

getting paid at that same time as well.

So we've been continually pushing that
as they move forward, that in, in the

next budgeting process, that they pass
some sort of, um, a requirement that

for Coast Guard active duty, you know,
members of the military, uh, that they

don't have to worry about their paychecks.

Um, if you are serving our country,
if you are deployed, the last

thing you need to worry about is
if your direct deposit's going in.

And, 'cause then you're worrying about
things back home instead of worrying about

the plane that you're flying that may be
going over Iran at this time and moment.

Mark Treichel: Yeah.

Jason Stverak: Thankfully, uh,
defense credit unions and, and the

entire credit union industry stood
up very tall, uh, when Congress

was unable to get its job done.

Uh, you had like Keesler Credit Union
out of Mississippi where they literally

just told their members, "Okay, uh, for
the next 90 days, if every two weeks

you're getting $3,800 as your take-home
pay, you can count on that being there

Mark Treichel: Nice

Jason Stverak: They said, "We will
commit our reserves to make that happen."

Now, that, that gets a little bit tricky
is if you are paying, you're putting

the paychecks in, and then you are
saying, "We're gonna forgo your mortgage

payments, your credit card payments."

So there's a dramatic decrease
in money coming in, a dramatic

increase in money going out.

You know, and then when the auditors
come in and take a look, they say,

"Hey, you got a little troublesome with,
uh, your reserves at these points."

And thankfully the NCOA, uh, was
very gracious in working with

member credit unions, uh, as they
were working through this process.

So, it's it's a Band-Aid
you know, solution.

The solution is keep them paid-
Right … you know, and keep

politics out of these issues.

Um, but thankfully our men and women
in their, uh, in the armed forces,

the Coast Guard, our veterans, uh,
and, and as importantly their families

uh, you know, had the assurance
that money was gonna be there.

They could keep their, you
know, bills being paid.

You know, and to the point you, you
know, where there were some gaps in

that, uh, in that first shutdown, you had
credit unions setting up food banks to

make sure that, members of the military
and their family is, could have food.

And it is troublesome that we have
members that are, you know, enlisted

members in the military who don't
get who are, whose pay level is

set so they also get food stamps.

Mark Treichel: Yeah,

Jason Stverak: right.

And that, that, and that's, that,
that is a separate issue we hope that

Congress will begin to address as
it deals with, financial readiness

for us is military readiness.

And we hope that, uh, that we don't have
to deal with this issue in the future.

But, uh, we're thankful uh, we believe
as they funded DHS to 2028 from our

understanding that covers Coast Guard.

Uh, so we won't have to worry
about them being left out of that

solution if we go through a shutdown.

And- Just putting a little bit of looking
over the horizon, you have a very they

haven't passed any of the spending
bills yet or ha- into, signed into law.

The government r- will run out of
funding on September 30th at midnight.

Uh, so if they don't pass a continuing
resolution by then, we'll be in another

government shutdown, and we've already
begun prepping, uh, our defense credit

unions in the, in the entire industry and
saying, "Whatever plan you have, dust it

off because you need to be ready," 'cause,
you know, middle of September people

are gonna start asking, "What do I do?

What's my mortgage?"

You know, "How do I pay
for my kid's college?"

You know, you need to be able to say
what programs you're gonna have in

place for them because members of
Congress, uh, will be looking for it.

But we're continually pushing them to
say to get this thing done, get a CR,

or if they get so- something particular
that, that they deal with those who

have committed to serve our country,
that they are taken care of even if

there is no spending bills agreed to.

Mark Treichel: Boy, oh boy, a
lot going on, that's for sure.

Jason Stverak: Yes, sir.

Mark Treichel: You know, I s- also
saw a post you did about Jackson area.

I've done several Jackson area posts.

I've done two Jackson area podcasts.

Uh, and the essence of uh, part of
the essence, I, I don't wanna speak

for you, but part of the essence, if I
remember right, of your post was that

the ABA and the bankers were trying
to make a mountain out of a molehill

for it happening in credit unions.

Uh, you wanna kind of expand on- Yeah
… that or touch on anything related to that?

Jason Stverak: No, y-
you're 100% right, Mark.

I, I think that, and you know, while
nobody has been convicted yet, uh,

you know, it's, it's, it is alleged-
Alleged, yes … it is alleged.

Mark Treichel: Yep.

Jason Stverak: You know, out there.

There are some incredibly serious
issues that have been raised.

And I think they need to be
investigated, they need to be looked at.

If governance needs to change, um,
then we need to, we need to lead

as an industry to police our own.

If there needs to be more board training,
if there needs to be more you know,

internal checks or good practices, then
we as an industry need to instill that

within all of our member institutions.

But what is disheartening to me is to
see the moment that story got legs here

in Washington and started to, you know,
get, get published, it was being sent by

ICBA, ABA, the banking trades, you know,
directly into the inboxes of members of

Congress and their staff saying, "This
is an example of the entire industry.

We need hearings.

We need to…"

I, I mean, they're … Th- they had
the, "They need to fill out a 990 form."

I'm like, what would a 990 form uncover
on any of these issues in, in, in Jackson?

"This shows the need,
we need to tax them."

And it's the tired kind of same
argument that, that, that the

banking, that the banking trades have
always used to try to cripple credit

unions, and to impact our tax status.

And, and in the op-ed that, that, that
you reference on, that, that I posted

on LinkedIn, we talk about the fact
that, okay, here every … Here, you

look at all the other issues with, uh,
with, uh, with the banking industry, uh,

that they didn't immediately come out
and call, or we didn't, for increased

FDIC regulation or anything like that.

Identify the problem and fix the problem.

Don't use this as an opportunity
to try to score political points.

Uh, I always like to remind my,
my brethren in the banking trades

that I can't remember a time
that the credit unions have ever

crashed the American economy.

Mark Treichel: Yeah.

Jason Stverak: I can sit on my hand
and name five times, you know, in my

lifetime that a b- bank has caused
these types of issues, and we just

wanted to set that reality, and we're
always gonna speak on behalf not only

of defense credit unions, but the
entire industry when these scurrilous

attacks come from the banking industry.

If there is a problem, let's fix it.

We should be the first one to
stand up and say, "You know what?

Here are the five changes
that need to happen.

Here's how we're gonna do better."

But this should not be an opportunity
for the banks to come along and

say, tax them, fill out their 990s,
drag them in front of C- the entire

industry in front of Congress,
uh, and, and, and criticize them.

The fact is, is that credit unions
provide an incredible service, whether

they be the size of Navy Federal or
they be the smallest credit union you

have out there, uh, in your community.

And by the mere fact that nearly 146
million Americans are members of credit

unions, we must be doing a very good job.

Mark Treichel: Well said.

You know, and o- one of the things I
do not a lot of people do this, I don't

think, but I go back through IG reports,
NCUA's IG reports, FDIC's IG reports.

And when this broke I had a banker
make a comment on one of my posts, you

know, that's credit unions being credit
unions, and it's like, "Well, hey,

you forgot to look at the October, uh,
2025 FDIC report, where Pulaski Savings

Bank had a 28, $30 million loss because
they had two sets of books, right?"

Yep.

And they were only 45 million, so that was
actually a bigger asset percentage loss.

They weren't on the books, just
like the deposits weren't on the

books at, at, uh, Jackson Area.

So if you live in a glass
house, uh, don't throw stones.

And they need to look at how
that happened, and NCUA needs

to look how this happened.

And like you said, what are the solutions?

How can, how can NCUA make it better?

Should they take a request
to Congress on changing the-

Jason Stverak: Mm-hmm

… Mark Treichel: Federal Credit Union
Act on the asset level for CPA

opinion audits, which is a very
political charged, uh, thing to touch.

But, I mean, there's things that,
that will be looked at at NCUA- Yeah

looked at, y- individual credit
unions should look at it, saying,

"Okay, what happened there?"

Exactly.

"What are my internal controls?

What do we wanna do?"

And, you know, maybe you're at
450 million in assets and you

decide to get a CPA opinion audit.

I think a lot of $450 million
credit unions probably do that.

And they're not required
to, but it's a better audit.

Jason Stverak: No, I, I, I, I agree
with your statement, and I, I think it's

important that, you know, every, uh,
credit union CEO, and most importantly

every credit union board member and
board of directors, you know, takes

a look at, at, at, at the issues that
have been uncovered already at Jackson,

and say, "What are we doing different
to ensure that this doesn't happen?"

And if, if it's, there were policies
in place but nobody followed

them, then, you know, what are
we doing in terms of training?

What are we doing in terms of attracting
the right board members that are

gonna say, "Hey, wait a minute,
this doesn't make sense," you know?

And, why does, why is one person
able to control the inflow and

outflow, uh, of the credit union?

Those are s- those are probably
pretty good questions to ask.

And I think we need to hold ourselves
to the higher standards because if

we don't and we lose the trust of our
members, they're gonna walk with their

feet and they're gonna go somewhere else.

Mark Treichel: You got it.

Well said.

Well, we've touched on earlier, you know,
the expansion of DCUC, but if you could

kind of walk through that a little bit.

I know you, I mean, you don't have
to be a- Oh, got yeah, oh … a

fast-started credit union.

You- and your growth is, you know,
I, I see every once in a while, y-

you- today you got a new member,
tomorrow you get a new member, and

that seems to be, uh, taking off.

Can you kind of talk through if someone
is listening to this and they're thinking,

"Hey, how do I, how do I join DCUC?"

How does that work?

Jason Stverak: You can
reach out, go to dcuc.org,

uh, and j- and just click and, and
there, there's a form for you to,

uh, ask questions about membership.

And you're 100% right, uh, Mark,
you don't have to be a defense,

quote, unquote, "Defense credit
union" to be a member of DCUC.

You know, we have veterans as part of it.

We call it our field of membership.

Um, the Department of Veterans Affairs a
few years, uh, you know, did an analysis

and said, "Within every ZIP code within
the United States, there's a veteran."

So w- you know, we're of the same belief.

In every credit union across this
country, there's a veteran or an active

duty service member or a relative of
a, a, of a member of the military.

And as I said earlier, the issues that
impact us are impact every credit union.

We just have that k- additional expertise.

Like, one of our newer members we got
a phone call, and they said, "Hey,

we've never done a VA home loan before.

Can you help us?

What forms?"

You know, it's like, they're a
new member and, you know, a- a-

and so we were happy to do that.

And, you know, we're happy
to, uh, to work with them.

You know, we, we just had a a, a new
member come on board because they were

expanding their field of membership to
cover you know, National Guard within

their state, because nobody else was
covering them, and they're adding

2,000 or 3,000 members because of that.

They just got approved, uh, by the
state to include them in, in, in, in,

in, into their field of membership.

You know, and, and one of the benefits,
and, and I know everyone looks at

the bottom line we cap our dues.

Uh, you know, uh, the most that any
credit union, and I'm talking PenFed,

that type of size credit union,
you can pay is $22,500, and the

vast majority is less than $1,000.

And- Wow … uh, because we go,
we don't wanna have membership

dues be the reason we exist.

We exist to serve our members, and
thankfully, you know, we raise our,

we raise the vast majority of our
funds elsewhere you know, uh, uh,

to be able to support our efforts.

And we hadn't raised our dues
since 1996 until last year.

Mark Treichel: Wow.

Jason Stverak: Uh, and we voted, the
members voted by over 90% to double their

dues to be able to be more proactive, to
hire me, um, you know, and, and, and to

have a more robust advocacy team, w- which
we're expanding into regulatory advocacy

because, um, we need to be able to support
our members as they come to us with their

questions and asking for help, not only
over at the Department of War or the VA,

uh, but also at the CFPB, the NCUA, and
at every, uh, all 535 members of Congress

uh, and throughout the executive branch.

So if anybody's interested, it's
an incredible opportunity for you

to become part of a team that, uh,
we really believe it- it's access.

Um, if you ever need, if you ever
need to get ahold of me, every single

one of our members has my cellphone.

Every single one of our members
has our CEO's cellphone.

You know, you can get ahold of us.

I appreciate ph- not phone calls
after midnight, but uh, i- if you need

help we're there for you, uh, because
it's truly mission-oriented for us.

Um, and, we'll do, w- we will do
whatever you need to help you get the

rules, the regulation, the laws in
place for you to serve your members.

So long soapbox way of saying
everybody can join in, uh, DCUC.

You are welcome.

You don't have to be on a military base.

You know, we, we, I think we just added
three new members in the last 10 days-

Nice … yeah, that, that have come.

We've had, we have teacher credit unions,
we have firefighter credit unions.

We have oil and gas.

We have, you know, uh, all the way to
your traditional I'm, you know, I'm

on, uh, you know, to Andrews Federal
Credit Union at Andrews Air Force Base.

There is a home for every
credit union at DCUC.

Mark Treichel: That's fantastic.

And, and the last question I've got-

Jason Stverak: Yeah

… Mark Treichel: is conferences coming up.

Yeah.

So you talk about being the members.

You, I know you guys do
a lot of conferences.

Any- anything exciting?

Uh, w- so what's coming,
what's the arc of that?

Well, we got a- … I know you don't have
it at your fingertips, but if you do,

what's coming up here in the second half?

Jason Stverak: No.

Um, we actually, we'll
have our annual meeting.

It's August 3rd through the 6th, uh,
down in Aventura, which is Miami.

We purposely book to find
the most affordable place.

So if it's in the summer, we're gonna
go to the warmest place, uh, uh-

Mark Treichel: Just like NCUA used to do.

There,

Jason Stverak: there you

Mark Treichel: go.

We

Jason Stverak: could

Mark Treichel: get really good prices
in- Right … in Florida in the summer.

Yep.

Jason Stverak: Right.

You know, and we, this year we trimmed
a day off of it, so we're, we're

trying to pack everything in there,
so to be mindful of people's, uh,

travel t- travel time and, and, and
the costs that are related to it.

We have a very, you know, we have a,
we do have a, a strong military theme.

Uh, as, uh, as part of our speakers,
former US senator Sen- uh, I can't

remember her, uh, her name from Arizona.

She was the first, uh,
Air Force fighter pilot.

Mark Treichel: Oh, y- I
don't know, but- So- Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I don't remember, either.

Yep.

Yeah.

Jason Stverak: And then, um, you
know, we're having, uh, one of

the fire captains who was in the
towers on 9/11 is gonna be there.

It's, it's about leadership, it's
about passion, it's about emotion.

Uh, we present our gala awards for, and
you know, in, into our Hall of Honor.

But what's really different than, you
know, uh, a lot of the other annual

meetings or national trade association
events that you'll go to is it's really a

sense of family Um, 'cause coming from the
military, which a lot of our m- members do

or coming from credit unions with a sense
of service, uh, uh, for who they represent

it's really like a family reunion.

And it- I didn't believe that until
my first time, uh, and it really

is, and it's like long friendships.

Uh, you know, uh, y- you
get reunited with people.

We also have a sense of service.

Uh, we do a golf tournament beforehand
where we raise money, not for us,

but for, uh, specific charities.

Uh, this year's, I believe, it's the
USO w- we'll raise, uh, funds for.

Um, but we also have something
that's kind of exciting.

We call them our sub-councils, where,
uh, in a region like Texas or the

Northwest or, um, you know, uh, we'll be
launching more of them, or the Midwest

where it's just those credit unions
from that area where you can drive in.

Uh, and it's a smaller, intimate,
where we talk about issues that we're

facing, uh, where if you can't get to
the annual meeting or you just don't

have that travel budget, we're gonna
come to as close to you as possible.

Um, our next Texas sub-council's
in El Paso, you know, so w- we've,

w- we try to go to where you are
and ask, what do you need to hear?

What do you need from, uh, uh, from us?

We try … Uh, we don't make, we
try not to make them as a, we're

here to raise money off you.

We want it to be about what do you need
to become better credit union leaders?

Uh, we've expanded our, uh, breakouts,
something that we just started last

year as part of our annual meeting
where we talk about the issues

that are, um, facing credit unions.

We just had in March, in San Francisco, a
CU Unplugged, uh, where we bring in the,

we tech people and you, and, and, and
you sit and you build apps and you build,

uh, where there's no agenda other than
you guys bouncing ideas off each other

and solving problems for credit unions.

So, I think it's something that you have
to experience, but once you do that one

time, you'll never regret either joining
DCUC or coming to these events, uh,

because you'll meet people that, … we
used to have a saying, well, growing

up, that I may not help you commit the
murder, but I'll help you bury the body.

You're gonna get those types of friends,
uh, that, uh, that you'll meet at DCUC.

Mark Treichel: Very good.

And as always, Jason, I've had
a lot of fun chatting with you.

You mentioned if someone wants
to join to go to the website.

If someone, if, if someone wants to get
in touch with you I don't want you to give

your cellphone number, uh, over the, the
wires here, but, um, i- is sh- is that the

best way for someone to reach out- Yeah

or if they

Jason Stverak: want

Mark Treichel: to link you?

Jason Stverak: To reach me,
you just use my email address.

Uh, it's open.

It's all lowercase
letters, jstverak@dcuc.org,

and I'll happily answer any
questions that y'all have.

And, uh, if it's not under my
area, I'll connect you with

the team, uh, that we have.

We're, we're a small and lean team,
and we punch above our weight.

But, uh, we do that 'cause we have
incredible members, and we'd love

to have, uh, more of you join.

Mark Treichel: Yeah, small and
lean means that you're nimble.

You can move quicker- That's exactly right
… than bigger organizations, right?

So-

Jason Stverak: Absolutely

… Mark Treichel: that was, that was,
that's the NCUA advantage in some

instances compared to bigger agencies.

So awesome.

I'm gonna put your email
address in the show notes.

Jason, I wanna thank you for your
time today, uh, and sharing your

wisdom with my listeners and watchers.

Jason Stverak: My pleasure, Mark.

Thanks for everything.

Mark Treichel: You got it.

And listeners, watchers,
I thank you for watching.

I hope you'll do the same again soon.

This is Mark Trakel signing
off with Flying Colors.