Credit Union Exam Solutions Presents With Flying Colors

Treichel: Hey everyone, this
is Mark Treichel with another

episode of With Flying Colors.

I'm excited today to be here with
Jason Sterk, the Defense Credit Union

counsel, chief Advocacy Officer.

Jason, how are you doing this morning?

I'm doing great.

Mark, yourself.

I'm doing great.

I'm down in Hollywood, Florida.

The sun is shining, and I
reached out to you last week.

I've, you've been pretty active,
the world's been active, but you've

been having some really cool posts
on LinkedIn and some really nice

things that you're doing for credit
unions in general and for DCUC.

So I wa I thought it'd be good.

We haven't chatted in a while.

I thought it'd be good to catch
up and talk about some hot topics.

Absolutely,

Jason Stverak: Look forward to
talking to you and your listeners.

Treichel: Yeah, very good.

And for a listener who may not be aware of
DC uc, and what it is you're doing, if you

could give a summary of the organization
and your role and in the organization.

Jason Stverak: Yeah, happily DC uc
or the Defense Credit Union Council

is the pro Predo is the preeminent
voice for defense and veterans credit

unions all across the industry.

We're going pa into our 61st
year of being in existence.

But we have been advocating primarily on
behalf of defense related credit unions.

And if you go back in time, those
were the ones that were just on base.

Or on the military installation,
but as the credit union industry has

changed, credit unions have grown,
defense credit unions have grown,

off base to serve more people.

We've expanded our reach as in terms of
our advocacy priorities because we like

to say we represent every credit union
because every credit union has a veteran.

And we're very proud of that.

And we look forward to
continually growing our.

Advocacy efforts 'cause the issues
that impact your credit union impact

defense credit unions as well.

Treichel: I think that's a great
point to make, especially, I'm sure

you were over at America's Credit
Union's, G-A-C-A-A, as was I.

And, NAFCU and Q emerged which is
generally viewed as a good thing, but one

of the aspects of that is there's one less
voice, one less letter writer to Congress.

And I think it's important to hear from d
different perspectives and I think that's

something that DC uc has always done, but
you can fill a little bit of a void there.

I.

With there being one less trade
association out there, I think the

importance of those that are left
is even that much more important.

Jason Stverak: Obviously I agree
with you a hundred percent, mark.

And, the phrase iron sharpens
irons is incredibly important.

But the ability for the different voices.

In the credit union movement we may
sing the same song but we need multiple

voices working on behalf of the movement.

And we're proud to speak on behalf
of our defense related credit unions

and veterans related credit unions.

But we're not afraid to talk about
issues that impact every credit union

from my home area of the Dakotas.

We worked with just an example with Dax
eu to work on letters to the Senate Ag

Committee and in the House Ag Committee in
relation to what we can do to help open up

access to capital in rural America and the
issues that every credit union has with

farm credit services in rural America.

Treichel: Very good.

It's funny that you with that connection,
you just reminded me of something.

So when I started at NCA back in
1986, I had parts of South Dakota

and North Dakota in my district.

Jason Stverak: Oh, fantastic.

Treichel: And I remember a
credit union that shall rename

nameless a really good one.

And they shared they had a building and
they shared it with Farm Credit Services.

They had a lease, a long-term
lease with Farm Credit services,

and it, they really played a good
positive role in that community.

So I hadn't thought about
that place in a while.

Jason Stverak: No, absolutely.

And you, some people say when
they talk about the Dakotas,

they call it fly over country.

I just call it home amen.

Treichel: Amen.

Very good.

Very good.

So interesting times we're living in,
with the new administration and what

that means and what it doesn't mean.

But there's also some things
that are out there that kind of

intertwine with the administration.

Some things that were going on
before Trump took office and one of

those that I wanted to mention, and
you had a really nice post on this

the other day the Durban Marshall
Bill, also known as the credit card.

Competition act.

Yep.

And that relates to interchange income.

If you could tee that up, what that.

Bill is supposed to do what it
really does and how it in my opinion,

and I think in your opinion, it's
gonna be harmful to credit unions.

But if you could walk through
that, I think that'd be great.

Jason Stverak: Yeah.

Obviously the Creditor Competition Act
impacts interchange and I'll give the,

the higher level discussion of that
and it's negative impact specifically

to defense credit unions, but the
entire credit union industry that.

When we go and use our credit
cards, I'm not talking debit,

I'm talking credit cards.

The majority of Americans want safe and
secure transactions and what we have

in the Durban Marshall Amendment is a.

Move by government to force a
additional, payment networks to

come in and dramatically impact
the interchange revenue that your

local credit union's gonna have.

And where that specifically impacts
defense credit unions is that many of

the individuals as they're coming into
the military, 18, 19, 20-year-old kids,

let's be honest with that's what they are.

Don't have a credit history
or may have a, made some poor

choices in their teenage years.

And they walk into the local credit
union, just say, you know what?

I need a credit card, a $500 limit,
a thousand dollars limit just

to be able to handle expenses.

And interchange allows
defense credit unions.

To take a risk on that individual
and there can be no higher

calling for a credit union,
specifically a defense credit union.

For those that are willing to, on
their own, make the choice to serve our

nation, they are worth us as financial
institutions to say, you know what?

We're gonna make sure that if your car
breaks down, you're gonna have enough.

Access to capital, that's what it is.

Access to capital on your credit card
to be able to make those payments

or to be able to make sure that
you can get groceries for the week.

Because, the sad fact is that many
of those at the E four, that type

of level of enlisted personnel
they're at the poverty level.

A lot of 'em are on food stamps.

So that minimal access to capital that
defense credit unions can provide for them

is sometimes the the difference between
making it or not making it that month.

And if you, we don't have those resources,
we're not gonna be able to take that

risk on the person who has a slightly.

Le less than ideal credit
score or no credit score.

And we're gonna say, you know what?

We don't think you're worthy to serve.

Go out the front gate to the payday loan
lenders and pay four, 500, 6% interest.

And we're just putting
them in a cycle of debt.

And that's wrong.

And that's why we're fighting
so hard to ensure that.

Every credit union has the resources
it needs to be able to serve those

that others have left behind or
are just starting to enter, the

American financial lifecycle,

Treichel: And that, that's very well said.

And as you're thinking that,
I'm thinking about, the.

The theoretical discussion about
just the concept fees are bad.

It's easy to think fees are bad,
we, fees should be lower without

thinking about the ramifications
of those fees on the real world.

And there's no more real world than the
person you just described who's trying to

get started trying to defend this country.

And those fees.

Serve a purpose.

They create the infrastructure so that
the credit unions are able to provide

that service and that if there is a
loss or there are costs associated with

it, and oh, by the way, the staff that
they have, the credit unions have to

hire to operate that program, whether
it's the accounting side or whether it's

dealing with, visa or whoever directly
the inflation on those folks, right?

So you got the inflation driving up
the salaries of the folks administering

it, and you've got this law.

Proposing taking away the fees
that in reality subsidize it.

And it the whole junk fee
concept is linked to this.

And they may not directly be linked,
but they are linked in my mind.

Jason Stverak: They, no,
mark, they are linked.

They're a part of the threat or,
the, the pressure on non-interest

bearing income for credit unions, and.

I was on a call when I was at a CU
with then CFEP, director Chopra, and

we were talking overdraft and we were
talking, the, the driving down overdraft

fees and limiting them and the and
the comment was made you can just

make it up on credit card interest.

And it's at some point.

E the more you take away from revenue
streams that you're gonna have to cut

somewhere, you're gonna cut in terms of
branches being open, hours being served,

programs being offered, et cetera.

When dur, we call it Durbin 1.0,

this is, going back, 2010 and
they did this for debit card.

And they promised it's not
gonna be a reduction in service.

Free checking's not gonna go away.

Rewards are not gonna
go away for debit cards.

Money's gonna be passed on to the
consumer and all those things.

Never ha it never came to fruition.

You've got the, the Richmond Fed coming
out with a study that there were no

cost savings passed along, et cetera.

It's, we have empirical evidence that
the promises made now by the Durban 2.0

supporters, senators Marshall and Senators
Durban are not gonna come to fruition.

And for many people, the kind of the,
not the dirty little secret, but the

kind of unheard of is that for defense
credit unions, they lose money having.

A branch on base because, because of
security, there's no foot traffic,

there's just the members that you know.

And so there, there a fully staffed,
fully operational branch of the

credit union that might have four
or five people walk through or, 10

cars drive through, the drive through
with the tellers, but they're there.

It is a lost leader
because they believe it is.

Their boards of directors and their
members and their leadership believes that

it is their obligation their commitment
to service to so that, that airman or

that marine who gets off at four and they
need to get, they, they need to get cash

to pay the babysitter on their way home.

They're gonna be there till five or six
if you take away interchange, if you take

away other, additional revenue streams.

You're gonna force that credit
union say, you know what?

We're only open two days a week.

We're only gonna be
open from nine to three.

And what that does, ultimately, let's
keep walking those dominoes as they're

falling, is that you're creating
additional stress on an individual that

serves in the military who may within
24 hours notice, be deployed and then.

Honey, you need, you gotta tell
your spouse, your husband, your

wife or partner hey, you gotta go
down and make the mortgage payment.

It's not open.

Who I need to call somebody, I've
gotta get everything ordered.

There's nobody there.

The call center got closed down
'cause they don't have the resources.

There's the unintended consequences
of this are mind boggling.

My, my are numbing as well in that,
financial readiness for defense

credit unions is military readiness.

If you're deployed let's go
an example, it's in the news.

I'm not breaking any news here.

News, you deployed seven B twos from
Whiteman Air Force Base out of Missouri.

So you've got seven crews who have
may or may not families on base.

There's the defense credit union.

You're told to go, may don't know the
amount of lead up time that you had.

They've been deployed over to Diego
Garcia in the middle of the Indian Ocean.

Not, I'm fairly confident there's
not a branch there of their credit

union, but they can feel confident
that their local defense credit union

on base, they, somebody from their
family walks in, they'll take care of

'em and they'll be there as long as
they need them to be there because.

Interchange, and I know
I'm circling it back.

Interchange allows them the resources
they need to ensure that, it is a

political, the political term kicked
around for the Bush administration.

No one is left behind, right?

And no one of the military, starting
with the active duty to their families

is forgotten or missed as that.

Service member deploy so that they
can focus on doing their job and

in some instances staying alive.

And they don't have to worry
about, hey is it can my is the

mortgage payment gonna be made?

Is the credit card gonna be being made?

Is someone gonna work?

We've got coming up and, we
got people worrying about.

I gotta make sure my taxes are filed in
time, those, and the credit union becomes

that, that flag, that main tent flag pole
tent post where all of those financial

readiness issues come together and and
it starts with having the resources to

do it, and it gets back to interchange.

Treichel: No, that's very well said.

That was a great summary of how it impacts
the military credit unions in particular.

And you touched upon the overdraft
protection as well and, the lack

of the interchange can cause things
that trigger services to dry up

and push towards payday lending.

Same can happen with
overact draft protection.

A lot going on with the capping of
the fees to the Trump administration,

trying to blow that up to the
NCA board under Biden saying the

large credit unions need to pro.

Report more ul, excuse me, report more
granular information to chairman Halman,

then saying we a reverse on that to,
to Harper and ska taking not offense to

that to saying that pivot doesn't make
sense and there should be transparency.

Any more thoughts on any of those?

Tentacles related to overdraft protection
as it relates to defense, credit unions.

And, no,

Jason Stverak: We're very happy
that the, the Congress is moving

forward with the Congressional Review
Act, repeal of the CFBs overdraft

protection, overdraft lowering it to $5.

And granted, I the argument
on the counter size this only

impacts 10 billion above, but.

It impacts the entire industry.

If you're if it's pen fed and you at
the local credit union, across the

street or across town, if they've got
a $5 overdraft fee, you gotta match it.

That, that's competition.

Absolutely.

Everyone can understand that.

Absolutely.

So $5 for them is $5 for you.

The Senate Banking, housing and
Urban Affairs chairman Tim Scott.

Introduce sj Senate Joint Resolution
18, which would and by an act

of Congress roll this back.

It passed the Senate last week.

It is expect it is scheduled to
be on the house floor this week.

We expect that it will pass, then be
signed into the law by the president.

We think this is a good thing.

The decision on what an accredit
union's overdraft program should

be decided by the members.

We're democratically controlled.

We have credit unions that
have eliminated the fees.

We have credit unions that have
dramatically lowered them because

that is what that credit union and its
members believed is the best policy

because they've had to make that choice.

If we don't have overdraft fees,
how are we gonna make sure we have

the revenue as we discussed earlier?

Keep the doors open,
handle these programs.

They said that was best
for their communities.

And y you know what?

The great thing I is about the
Overdrive programs with credit unions

is that you have to opt into 'em.

They're fully disco disclosed.

It's when you set up your
account, you can ask for it.

They explain it to you.

But the one thing that nobody really talks
about, and I'm guess I'm dating myself

here, that with my gray hair is that I
can remember a time going to my local

grocery store back home in South Dakota
where there would be a list of people

that says, do not accept a check from.

And your name.

So here's here's the question
you wanna ask yourself.

Do you wanna go back to that situation?

Or do you want an individual
who is, four 30 on a Friday, is

trying to, use their debit card
to buy groceries for the weekend.

Might have just miscalculated
or doesn't have enough funds

that you want it to go through.

Then there's no issue, no embarrassment,
nobody's called out, and then there's a

fee associated with that you've agreed to.

I would rather have that than the, what,
you need to return all the items and and

have that if you're a credit union, you
wanna be known as the credit union that

prevents people from buying groceries.

Nobody does, no community bank
does, in, in all honesty, I'm sure

even Chase doesn't, we, we can have
that discussion at a later point.

If you support doing away with
all overdraft fees, are you

prepared for the replacement?

Because what will have to happen
is that you're not gonna allow

your account to be overdrawn.

That just makes sense.

And are you prepared
to return to that part?

Or return to that system and for I
think mo majority of Americans, but most

importantly for the majority of credit
union members, boards of directors and

credit union champions and leaders.

No, that's not what we want to do.

We have a, we have something that
I think the latest polling or data

released, even last week was over two
thirds of the people in this country.

Are happy with overdraft.

I know credit unions, from PenFed
and others, they have if they see

you having, multiple sit down with
you, give them a call give you

financial training, is there an issue?

I've seen I know there are defense
credit unions Hey, the payroll changed.

The spouse.

So they had their bills on autopay,
but they didn't change it when

the new pay, change in when the
money was being deposited in the

account, they were getting hit.

So it's hey, let's help
make that change for you.

And there are some people who
just need some budgeting help.

We used, I, when I was in high school,
I had two economics courses and we

did, how do you balance your checkbook?

Some of that stuff is not taught anymore.

So the credit unions have stepped
in particularly defense credit

unions to provide that training.

And one of the, one of the obligations
we have to serve on base is to provide

free financial literacy training
for anybody who walks in the door.

And we're happy to do that.

It overdraft is a necessary program
for individuals to ensure that.

They can purchase what
they need to purchase.

And, the economy can keep rolling

Treichel: and, and mergers happen because
fees evaporate and the ability to, to

fund staffing, to fund these programs
with smaller credit unions, at some

point in time they end up throwing the
towel in because they, because all these

regulations and the regulatory burden has
nibbled around the edges of what they.

So I'm excited that I'm excited that
you're excited that it looks like this

will pass and that this will be some
more permanence to local control of

what's appropriate for the credit union.

What's appropriate for that membership.

That, that.

People can avoid the payday lenders and
can avoid having their checks put up in

the bar or the restaurant saying, that
you're not a good person, if you will.

'cause they are good people.

Bad things happen,

Jason Stverak: absolutely

Treichel: bad things happen

Jason Stverak: to good people.

And it happens every day and thankfully.

Many of those situations there, there's
a credit union they can walk into.

Let me give you an example
of, what a credit union can do

for someone who's fallen down.

We have a defense credit union in Texas,
and they told me this story during a

meeting at our Defense Matters, which
was held at the time of GAC recently, and

they talked about that they had a kid.

Who had made some bad financial choices
when they were 16, 17 parents got him

a credit card, all that type of stuff.

And had fallen behind credit
card, credit score took a big hit.

And I.

The kid is up for an
appointment to West Point.

So the father and the son
walk into the credit union

and say, here's our situation.

What can you do to help credit
union without batting an eye?

Walks in and says, let's get you a loan.

Let's get these all consolidated.

Let's get this all taken care of.

Let's get your credit score back up.

Because in the military,
having huge deaths and a low

score is considered a risk.

And he was on track everything,
but this was the one thing that

was the red light for getting it.

They worked with him, helped him put
him back on track from my understanding

of kids going to West Point,

Treichel: fantastic.

That's what credit unions are all about.

Absolutely.

So you touched on we've touched
on CFPB, the edges of the CFPB.

I know you recently the DCUC had a,
some comments on potential restructuring

or, looking forward to what.

How to improve CFPB and a couple things.

There was a reference to all
the costs of their regulations.

And there was a reference to UAP
that caught my in interpretations

and how that's broad.

And then there was also a reference
to I think, creating an independent

inspector general for the CFPB, which
caught my eye because at NCUA we.

Have an in, independent inspector
General who reviews things of NCA.

So any of those three
things are all three of 'em.

You wanna highlight the udap.

The Inspector General and just
the general costs of CFPB regs,

Jason Stverak: In, in terms of general
costs it's death by a thousand cuts.

It's you hear oh, it's only gonna cost you
a couple bucks here, or five bucks here.

But at the end, when all of those
regulations start adding up, and

when you add CFPB on top of NCUA
on top of, the state and other.

Other obligations, that they have,
whether it's unemployment, insurance,

and o other stuff is running a business.

It can quickly cause you to.

For lack of a better
term, go out of business.

Merge.

I'm not talking about the pen
Feds, the navy feds, the vice

stars, the Randolph Brooks.

I'm talking about the credit union.

That's a hundred thousand dollars.

And there is one, and Todd er talked
about it in our defense matters that,

the, the 10, the five, the 15, the 20,
the 50 millions, a hundred millions.

It becomes a choice of okay, we can't
be open on Fridays, or we're gonna,

we're now 10 to four and then, you're
gonna it's about not hiring that next

teller to help ensure processing people
through in the morning, et cetera.

I.

Rolling back, the cost not only at
CFPB, but across government's important

because it frees up the credit union
to be able to serve its members.

Now, the, by a motto is to trust the
credit union to serve its members.

And, 99.9%

of the time, the credit union
makes the right choice on behalf

on behalf of it of its membership.

And then in terms of the, the
independent, IG just makes sense.

And the fact that you need someplace
that if there is an issue that you

can go to an independent arbitrator
it's it would be, it's hey you go to

you go to the car dealership, you get
sold to lemon, and you're person you

complain to is the car dealership.

And so what are they, who is their natural
alliance gonna, gonna be with, it's

gonna be with, with a car dealership.

But having that ability you know
what, I think I've been wrong, or

I think I have an issue to have
someone who's, who is independent.

But, and independent, truly independent.

Not for you, not for them, but it's
gonna find, adjudicate correctly,

I think is incredibly important.

And as they are reimagining.

What the CFPB can be in the
future, because let's have that

honest political discussion.

It's in statute, it's creation.

It sits on Fs o and, it's a part
of the it's a part it's a part of

the law that there is not 60 votes
in the Senate to get rid of it.

There is at best 53, maybe 54,
depending upon somebody's mood that day.

So what you need to do is take
this opportunity to do reforms.

We've advocated for a multi-member
commission, so it isn't one

individual, we've advocated for
changing its appropriation process

while the Supreme Court has ruled.

The current way is constitutional.

It doesn't mean that's the way it has
to be done, let's put it under the

appropriation process where Congress can
be that check to currently one person

deciding what they wanna do with, with
the US economy essentially moving forward.

Treichel: Yeah it, the way it was
structured, made it I think, I'm sure.

People who wanted it to come into play
realized how powerful it could become.

But now that you see that, they
basically say, I need this much money

because I say I need this much money.

And then they have the broad
interpretations of what Udap

means, and it's just one person.

It makes that, too powerful
of a position, in my opinion.

I love the idea of going to a commission
or, whether that's three or five, pick

a number of folks that that provides
that wisdom of crowd and less control

in one hand, I think would be a fabulous
change that, you're right, it's gonna

be here, but let's take an opportunity
to see if there's a ways to improve it.

So one o one other thing that I saw on,
on, on your LinkedIn was there was a story

that you reported on about vice presidents
JD Vance, praising Navy Federal Credit

Union for some things that had gone on.

If you could describe what
happened there for my listeners,

I think that'd be pretty cool.

Jason Stverak: Yes.

And vice president Advanced used
Navy Federal as a member of what

happened when he was in the Marines,
but I want your audience and everyone

to know that what Navy did is what
defense credit unions do every day.

Sure.

In terms of protecting them
from, predatory lenders.

And if you didn't see the story from
last week vice President Vance before

he went to Greenland spent some time at
Quantico here in, in the Virginia area

visiting with at the Marine Corps base.

You may have seen him shoot the
m you know, the M 2 4 3, the saw,

and that's what got the attention.

But part of his speech where he
talked about, he was a young Marine

and he talked about just being
outta high school, directionless,

not knowing where he, how to make
decisions, where he is going in life.

And he decided he needed
to go get a new car.

And wow, there was somebody right
outside that front gate that

was gonna be very happy to sell
'em a new car at 21% interest.

And so he walks back and tells his gunny
his gunny sergeant, I think it was,

and says, wow, look at this great deal.

I'm getting with 21% interest.

And he goes, looks at him like,
okay, we're gonna take you down.

Took him down to Navy Federal and
they worked out and got him what

the actual interest rate should be.

And this is the dirty little secret
that, that unfortunately we've seen

in the defense credit union industry,
but also the members of the military

have experienced is that they are
targets for predatory lenders.

That, for many of these, this,
that first check is the largest

check they've ever gotten, right?

This might be their first time they've
had a, a checking account and they're

like, you know what, I'm gonna blow it
all on a new a new car or the a hundred,

the 85 inch TV and the PS five, and, and
I'll just do it buying, I'll just do it

on the Renta Center, or I'll do it in,
five year payments to buy a PS five.

And they're not it's.

In financial decisions that are gonna
hinder you for a long time in the future.

And what that gun did, what that sergeant
did was help the vice president get to.

The institution that wants
to help the me, these service

members, and it was Navy Federal.

In this example, it's Hickum
out in, in, in Hawaii.

It's Randolph Brooks.

It's key, it's keys down in Key West.

Defense credit unions see this
happen every single day where they'll

have someone walk in and say, Hey,
I just was out at the car lot and

they're gonna finance me for 32%.

And they're like, okay, why don't
we just get you approved here?

It's 6% and they're like, 6%.

How'd you do this?

It's 'cause you're being taken
advantage of because they're

expecting you not to know any better.

And that's why defense credit unions be,
that they're the first line in defending

members of the military and their families
away from these predatory lenders.

And it gets back, go all the way
back to interchange that we are

able to do this because we have the
resources to take a risk and to,

be able to serve these members or.

There's no other choice than for them
to walk out the front door and get a

$500 payday loan at 200% in some percent
interest because, they just needed a short

term for three or four days, until their
check in, until their payroll came in.

Treichel: But a great story.

Yeah.

And a circle is complete.

'cause it all comes back to,
nibbling ways at the fees on the

interchange, et cetera, et cetera.

Jason, this was great.

Is there any questions, any other
things I should have asked you that

you'd like to discuss here today?

Jason Stverak: No, obviously the other
big issue we're all talking about

here in DC and up on Capitol Hill
is credit union tax status fight.

Oh yeah.

Last Thursday it's our understanding
house ways and means Republican

members did get together.

They did meet in terms of it
was a very general discussion

with the administration, what
the budget's gonna look like.

We're expecting probably the next two to
three weeks the, the pencils are gonna get

sharpened and we're gonna start having the
discussions about how to pay for things.

And that's where we need to make sure that
particularly defense credit unions and

all credit unions voices are being heard.

This week we are very
particularly targeting the

chair and ranking members of.

Ways and means in the House and
Senate financials do the writing of

the tax of the tax law with defense
credit union CEOs from their home

states in their home districts, so
that they understand the importance

of the tax status to defense, credit
union's ability to serve the military.

And again, it'll circle all the
way back if we lose our tax status.

There is.

Mil, depending on the size of
the credit union, hundreds of

thousands of dollars, millions of
dollars that then has to be found.

Sure.

And so you're gonna have to make choices.

Do you cut back on services?

Do you cut back on hours?

Do you cut back on?

Having, as we talked about, taking
a risk on those, on, on those, young

service members you're not gonna have
the resources to be able to do that.

So we are pushing you out the front
door through the front gate to the

payday loan lenders, because I.

We don't have the resources
anymore to be able to protect it

because now we gotta pay taxes.

Now in, the, ICBA has come along and said
it's only gonna be at a billion and above.

Whether you are navy federal or
you're, that a hundred thousand dollars

credit union, the DNA of a defense
credit union and every credit union

is to use that tax status to serve.

And I don't care what your size is,
the moment you start saying, okay.

A billion and above, you're essentially
you're you don't represent what a credit

union is anymore, and a billion and
a billion and below, you actually do.

So that doesn't make any
sense to me because I.

We get our tax status based upon, not
our asset size, but our structure and

what we do for the community, how we
give back, what we support because

the banks are organized around to
provide profit for their shareholders.

I have no problem with that.

That's the choice you
make that's fantastic.

Credit unions are organized
around, I've always said, even

when I was up on Capitol Hill.

The question of what can I do
to serve my community or for our

defense credit unions, what can
we do to serve those who serve?

And if you take our tax status
away, you are going to greatly

inhibit our ability to protect.

Our members who are
serving and protecting us.

And then it gets back
into that argument again.

If the, if we don't have the resources
to ensure that the financial readiness of

our members is met and insured, then we're
not gonna be, have the military readiness

to respond to threats around the globe.

Treichel: Well said.

Stated.

And it's so good that you're out
there communicating the message now.

Be before they're behind closed doors,
trying to make it all add up, right?

Because they need to know going into
those discussions on what the budget's

gonna be that credit union's tax
exemption needs to just be not up for

discussion and the fine work that you do
letting them know what credit unions do.

It's important times.

Very important times.

Jason Stverak: And it is like
that credit union difference

about that credit union in Texas.

There's another DCUC member that's not a
traditional defense credit union because,

any credit union can join DCUC 'cause
you have a veteran in party population.

ENBR Credit Union on Nashville,
I don't know if you follow their

program that they, a pilot program
that they have for cancer patients.

I've had multiple discussions with
their president and CEO Ron Smith,

and you should probably get him on.

Yeah.

Honestly, mark what this program
is that they've had, one of the

great and I speak of this coming
from some personal experience.

My wife is a cancer survivor, so what
they wanted to ensure is one of the

single greatest impediments to beating
cancer is stress and financial stress.

Sure.

And that they did not want, have
someone to be able to walk in to their

credit union and they're in their car
loan or their home loan and they just

throw the keys and says, I can't do
anymore 'cause I can't go to work.

And they're like, wait,
what's going on here?

Why?

Why are you doing this?

It's I got cancer.

I'm going through treatments,
I and I can't work.

And they're like, okay,
here's what's gonna happen.

All of your loans.

We're pushing them out six months, 0%.

Just show, just, there's the proof
that you could do it and you note from

your doctor, all that type of stuff.

Then, because we're gonna help you beat
this because you can't go to treatment

if you've had to turn in your car.

'cause you can't pay your car loan.

So it's like you're not
gonna worry about this.

Then they worry then six months,
five months into the months, talk

to you, Hey, how are things going?

Doing better.

Doctor says they still can't work great.

Pushing it out six more months,
and then they sit down, they

got you budgeted everything
else that you're taking care of.

What can we do?

And this is how Ron explained it to me.

And then let's say six more months
after that, they're like, you know

what, I've won, I'm in remission.

I'm going back to work next month.

And they're like, that's great.

We're gonna push out
another six months again.

But we're also gonna give you
probably a 0% interest loan to

make sure you're back on your feet.

And then we're gonna work with
you to reset up your payments so

that you're not hit right away.

With the car loan or the mortgage loan
or something, your mortgage payments

and so that, that credit union is
walking step in step so that you can

focus on winning the war on cancer.

And we will focus on having your back.

We.

Take care of you.

That's why we have our tax status.

That's why we, fight so
hard for interchange.

That's why, we talk about that,
that overdraft needs to be a,

a member to the union, to the
credit union discussion because.

That allows that credit union to have
resources to be able to do these things.

And that's, that, that's the choice
that a democratically organized,

financial cooperative can make.

And it's exciting to tell those stories.

I, I up with two members of Congress,
with, a couple weeks ago and they're

like, tell me why you should keep your
tax status and tell 'em that story.

Okay, done.

Yeah, you've.

And I don't fault banks or
anything, they're organized to make

sure this month or this quarter,
you've hit your share price.

We're organized to say.

At the end of this quarter, how many
kids got clothed, how many backpacks

we filled, going back to school,
how many, how many people we've

helped through, like what Enbr does.

Those are the things that are exciting.

Office there a little bit,
but just amazing that story.

Treichel: I love.

I love it.

What a powerful story that, that.

Best credit union story I've
heard in quite some time.

Jason this has been fantastic.

I appreciate all these great updates.

Interesting times.

If someone is listening and they'd
like to, every credit union has

somebody who's a veteran, right?

So if someone listens to this and
they'd say, Hey, I'd to talk about

the possibility of joining A-D-C-U-C,
or do they just wanna talk to you

about something in general, what's
the best way for someone to reach you?

Jason Stverak: Go to dc uc.org.

And you can click on and be able to
contact me or just my email address is all

lowercase letter J-S-T-V-E-R ak@dcuc.org.

We're on LinkedIn, Twitter,
Facebook, however you wanna

get ahold of us, let us know.

Or, if your local credit union
likely is possibly a member.

Go in, ask them.

We're there to help them 'cause we work
for them, and I know they work for you

as an individual credit union member.

Perfect.

Jason, thanks so much for your time

Treichel: today.

Thank you so much.

And listeners, I want to
thank you for listening.

As always.

I hope you will listen again soon.

This is Mark TriCal signing
off with flying colors.